Sounds like a hoot !
The 80's were very good to most people...
By 1985 I was working at Plant Vogtle and was a millwright journeyman...My pay went up quite a lot...I think it was around $13/15 an hour...And that could buy anyone a nice house and a new car...at the time!
Edit: In july of 1985 I made 16.45 an hour and I was damn proud...Now that money cant even support a young couple...Thats a Fact!
National average mortgage rate history of the entire 1980's was over 10% for the whole damn decade . And Bucky you claim to be a math wiz !
George F. Will hit is right on target, including his reference to George Wallace who I had in mind in my first post last night.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/opini...64b_story.html
I usually don't really follow all the candidates mainly because Indiana's primary is so late in the season, (May), that it's pretty much decided who the nominee will be by the time I get to vote. The vast majority of the candidates will have pulled out before our primary aren't even on the ballot here.
Unless Trump can magically create and responsibly communicate policies to support his bravado, CD's prediction will come to be. I don't see him being able to sustain it much longer with the attacks on him becoming more focused.
But... I remain resolute that knowing how to control social media and all the modern methods of communication is what got Obama elected, twice.
If I have time today I will tell y'all what I think Trump is causing............if anyone cares.
But I don't think anyone has hit it right yet.
Well, here's what I think Reagan's legacy is. I've always thought he was the last president we had that was bigger than the office. And I think that philosophically, he molded the foundation for what moderate conservatives of both parties pretty much think of government today.
1. Derregulation - Reagan did a lot to deregulate business. Telecom deregulation as did the demonopolizing of the entire industry happened under his watch and was the biggest thing in American business since Teddy Roosevelt busted trusts when he was a Republican president. That had a HUGE personal impact on my career. I went to work for a little company with 700 employees in 1979 and within three years had tripled my started salary and had gotten three promotions. Of course, as NoTill pointed out, inflation was in the double digits so salaries were in large part tied to the inflation rate. I made a ton of money on my first house too from being in one of the hottest real estate markets in the country (Dallas) at the time and in double digit inflation.
2. Fed Policy - Folks don't remember this, but before the Reagan era, the stock markets didn't hold their breath each quarter wondering if the Fed was going to raise interest rates. Using the Fed as a control measure of inflation was part of the reagan monetary policy and its probably impacted our lives economically more than any single thing Reagan or any other president has done since. The rest of 'Reaganomics' or supply side economics has been pretty much proven to be not effective. But this part sure was.
3. Tear Down the Wall - Reagan's stance in the Cold War happened in a perfect storm with a lot of economic shit to bring the USSR down, but it also helped it along. You have to give Reagan credit for his SDI policies for zapping whatever will the Soviets had left.
Those are my top three. Only one, coincidently, would be part of the Republican platform today and that's number three. that's why I think he was bigger than the office. No republican would ever bust up an AT&T sized company these days. No Republican would ever create a governmental lever to shove the economy today.
But if you think about Reagan objectively, how much could he have accomplished without Tip O'neill, the speaker of the House. They were ideologically different as night and day, but they got budgets passed every year, they got tax cuts (and a record number of tax increases) passed that reagan wanted, and all in a Democratically controlled House. Sure there were battles, but they worked it out and got it done. There's no way the current set of dildos would get half that done. Because they're more concerned about ideology than they are about America, plain and simple. Reagan and O'neill wasn't the first example of a president and House Speaker working together from opposite sides of issues, but they are damn sure the last.
One last thing I think Reagan left us. The Fucking Bushes. That's when the bitterness and rancor started escalating in American politics and that's when both sides started openly using governmental processes to achieve political aims. And its when the Republicans started using fear as their number one political platform.
But that's a negative on what I was trying to paint as the positive contributions of Reagan.
BKB
A) I agree with a lot of that. That's a good post.
B) However, you KEEP creeping in that little smarky stuff that rankles certain folks......."The Bleeping Bushes". I like W. I always did. He was a good President and I will be happy to defend what he did in a separate post. But you have to come along and add this, for no reason......you forget that Clinton AND Obama, and everyone else, voted 100% to continue to fund what you wingnuts call "The Bush War", at every opportunity. Yet, they skate! Why? They funded it, not him! And I'll bet a billion dollars there WERE WMD's! Regardless, he didn't boink a White House Intern and slide, or lie every other word. Yet the guy that did is folks' hero. You said you HATED "W" and nothing he did woulds satisfy you. Yet, when others make that claim about Obama, you don't like it. That's why folks get upset over discussing things with you. One good post, and you throw that it at the end, and light the flames.
C) Sherman AntiTrust and Breaking up ATT, just because they were big and By Gosh We Can't Have That, has a few good points, but they weren't perfect.........Claiming that as a Great Thing is not what I'd agree with 100%. Look at ATT now! What a mess.
D) And yes, I sold houses like water, and made a fortune there too. Jobs, houses, cars, it was all fast and furious. (See what I did there?)
I see. So only bright and cheery shit about Reagan is allowed here. And this rule made by Mr Bright and Cheery hisowndamnself.
BKB
No, that's not valid either. That's an invalid extreme to go to. NO one said "ONLY" anything. That statement is just a tactic to divert the discussion.
But what you said wasn't about Reagan. It was your attempt to get yet another dig in, on W. Even that is almost ok, but when you do not allow the same exact sentiment to be stated about Obama, that's when it gets started.
Well I thought this was about Reagan, not Obama. And the Bushes are a legacy of Ronald Reagan. After all, Bush cleaned up a Reagan mess by pardoning all involved in the Iran contra affair. And Bush and Reagan both granted amnesty to over 3.5 million illegals. both Bush and Reagan took actions to bolster Medicare. Both raised taxes but only Bush paid the price for it. Neither one of those guys would pass muster with the crazies we have running the GOP right now. you guys want to praise Reagan as the greatest president that ever served yet you'd ostracize ANY candidate that did the things both of those presidents did.
I strongly dislike both Bush's as presidents. The elder gets my nod because he's a decorated veteran and an outdoorsman and carried himself with respect. Bush II can kiss my ass and no amount of your whitewashing him will ever make me think otherwise. And without Bush I as president, we'd ever have had Bush II as president. and without Reagan, we wouldn't have had either.
And Obama's performance hasn't had anything to do with the topic of this post: Reagan and Trump. They're important because people say Trump is no conservative. Well friends, neither was Ronald Reagan.
BKB
Who was? Anyone?
I don't care what he was. He wasn't a Democrat.
You can label me, and Trump, anything you want. What I actually am, is an Anti-Democratic-Party person. If that has a label, lay it on me. But it's not GOP, or Conservative. Whatever the Democratic Party believes, I believe the opposite. There's zero of their policies I agree with. So I just vote for whoever runs against them. There never will be anyone who is for all that I'm for.
Barry, I think that's a pretty good analysis and I agree with it for the most part. I don't recall the animosity starting with Bush I. My recollection was that it started with the Clinton and got worse with the electoral college fiasco from Bush II/Gore. (I don't claim that to be an impartial view point as I think Clinton, who in reality didn't do that bad of a job running things, did more to tarnish the office than any President since Nixon.)
My biggest gripe with Bush I at he time was not finishing off Saddam Hussein. History, I think, has proven him right and not me. All that's done is further stabilize he region and we have Bush II and the neocons to blame for that bit of hubris.
Glad you have such a sound basis for your political beliefs and glad its working out so well for you then. Mine isn't much different, only like 180 degrees, but the methodology is much the same.
But don't try to bullshit your way through the reality of what these guys stood for. Both parties have morphed to the point, and you make it all the time, that a moderate has no voice any more. Nor do they even get an objective ear when it comes to how we should do things. And folks of your ilk have turned politics into hatred. I once read a post you made where you said you couldn't see yourself being friends with a liberal. The gist of it was that they are immoral. (Time to bring the abortion issue again in case you missed the chance thought I'd remind).
so enjoy Trump. You got what you deserved. I hope he wins the nomination.
BKB
Funny, but I thought Bush I did a much better job with Iraq than II. He outlined the mission, went in and did it, and came home. And I think he realized that as bad an actor that Saddam was, taking him down at the time would have created what we have today in Syria and in Iraq.
Funny how viewpoints differ.
BKB
Sigh.
I consider that a very low blow.
I am friends with several Liberals. I don't remember any such post. I don't feel that way. I remember, however, you saying that you hated George W Bush and would hate him even if he cured cancer. You didn't give reasons.
When you accuse me of things, it seems to me that even if the accusation is untrue, that you are just as guilty.
And when I hear you say, as you did the other day, that you consider Bernie Sanders a moderate, then I sort of discount your view of what a moderate is. But I do agree that it is not me that wishes for a Moderate to be in charge. And I have not turned politics into hatred............but I do believe I can pick out very hateful statements in almost every political post that you make. I assume you don't see those, but I do.
I do see why folks on this site that I THINK agree with me politically, don't post anymore, though.
And not once have I said I was a Trump supporter.
No, actually I think we're in complete agreement. At the time, I thought Bush 1 should have finished the job and screw he chaos that ensued. History showed me to be completely wrong and I see that pretty clearly now. In my defense, I saw the error of my ways and disagreed with Bush II and his nation building plans from the start.
I was going to describe to you, and Hank, why those right wingnut guys like Trump, and probably why Thump started the post. The list is long, but basically he says what they are thinking...........on most every subject.......and they are willing to give in to a few of his liberal policies, the ones that they can't win anyway, because of this. I have not supported him, I'm just reporting what folks I am around say. Here is a perfect example of why folks like the things he says:
This is from him and Cuomo.........
Do you think it is time to do something else about guns?” Cuomo asked. “Would you do something different with gun policy?”
“I don’t think I would, because this is really a sick person,” Trump said of the WDBJ shooter. “This isn’t a gun problem, this is a mental problem.”
Trump cited the recent thwarted terror attack on a Paris-bound train where U.S. servicemen helped take down the gunman and argued they could’ve more easily defended themselves if they were armed.
“Frankly, you know, a case like this, he snuck up on them — whether it was with a gun or a knife or whatever it would’ve been, it would’ve been something,” Trump said of the WDBJ shooting. “You’re not going to get rid of all guns.”
He continued, “I know one thing: if you tried to do it, the bad guys would have them…and the good folks would abide by the law — they’d be hopeless, and it would just be a hopeless situation for them.”
FYI, as you pointed out, I may have different definition of a moderate. In my definition a moderate is a person that won't step on his ideological dick. Ronald Reagan was one of the great moderates of our time as I've been trying to point out to you with several examples. He hated Medicare, yet he signed bills and worked with the Congress to save it and expand it. He did a lot of things that were outside of his ideological beliefs but were for the greater good of the country. He was bigger than he was supposed to be. A wingnut, or radical, or 'non-moderate' would be one of the 'my way or the highway' idiots we have in there today. Our system wasn't designed so that one party or one segment of the people could cram their ideals into law. It was designed so that from both sides of the argument we could decide the best course and take it. sometimes that's compromise, sometimes it isn't, and I understand that. But again, my whole point was to agree with whoever the hell said it that reagan was the best president of our time but to point out that it was his willingness to get outside of his personal belief box to make things happen that led him to do his greatest things.
And of the current field, Sanders and Kasich both fit that definition of what a moderate is. Nobody else really does that I've seen.
BKB
GOD I agree with Posthole on an issue other than fishing knots and white likker!
I probably do. That's a fault of mine.
But I do need to be able to notice when you are being meaner than a junkyard snake, and hypocritical to boot, and say so without YOU getting all ticked, too.
But that's just my opinion.
I see, so now I'm mean as snake. All because of what? Where did I say something mean to you? Because I said you'd said before you couldn't be friends with a liberal? You said it, and you've said it more than once. But that doesn't really matter.
You're a self procalimed immoderate. And that's fine and dandy. But don't get all butt hurt when somebody has a different opinion and calls you out on bullshit.
This is what you posted that I said was bullshit.
"I don't care what he was. He wasn't a Democrat.
You can label me, and Trump, anything you want. What I actually am, is an Anti-Democratic-Party person. If that has a label, lay it on me. But it's not GOP, or Conservative. Whatever the Democratic Party believes, I believe the opposite. There's zero of their policies I agree with. So I just vote for whoever runs against them. There never will be anyone who is for all that I'm for."
It might be your pure political belief (and I happen to know it isn't), but it's still bullshit. And as I TRIED to point out many times to get back to the original subject of the post, it certainly wasn't the description of the man most conservatives view as the greatest president ever.
And quit trying to make this post about you and me. It isn't. Its about Reagan. Or at least it was until you got all butt hurt.
BKB
Hehehe Posty said Butt Hurt. :D
See?
A) It ain't bullcrap. It's real, valid, and you can't stand it. So you get mean as a snake. Then you say you aren't doing that. My great gracious and a biscuit.
B) I never said such a thing. Prove it. If I didn't say it, saying that I did is being mean as a snake, ain't it?
C) "THIS post"? This is Goodhunting. Thumper can get over my bringing up baseball in a Nascar post, and you can get over my talking about me and you in ANY Post! Crap, dude............me and you are about 83.5054% of why this place is not dead as a freaking hammer!
D) You ain't butt hurt me! See, there you go again. If you disagree, you're doing it the right way. But when I call you out, I'm 'butt hurt'. And that post seems you're more butt hurt than I am.
E) I can call my position "Moderate" if I want to. You do it.
Can we talk baseball? If I have to talk about Trump and Hillary and That Crap for 420 more days I'm going postal!
You guys spend way too much time arguing about how you argue. You're gonna cause a black hole or schism shift of some kind of you keep it up!
Yes... I said schism shift. band name!